One or Two? Talion, the Kindly Lord in cEDH

Talion, the Kindly Lord

by Justyna Dura

The new spoiler season for Wilds of Eldraine started off with a cEDH banger: Talion, the Kindly Lord

I think the only two reasonable considerations regarding cEDH are one or two. Sure, Rhystic Study

Going Over the Numbers

Before I dive into my experience of the first dozen games I played with Talion

The popular "cEDH staple Cards" Moxfield list from nullmage (excluding commanders like Rograkh, Malcolm or Najeela

Unfortunately, many of those spells are seeing less play than they once did. When was the last time you saw someone cast a Ponder

That's why we should also take a look at the most successful decks in the format and how they influence our decision on which number to name. Take "The Cookout" for instance, a recent cEDH tournament hosted by Eminence Gaming. The top five decks were as follows:

At first I was dissatisfied with the outcome, because as we can clearly see, naming one is only marginally better than naming two.  Yes, Dan Brown's version of Thrasios and Bruse Tarl seems to play almost double the amount of spells that would trigger Talion

Data vs. Experience

Lacking enough data to feel confident about the right answer, I sleeved up the deck and played my first couple of games. As of today, I've played 12 games in mixed pods vs. different win conditions. Some games ended on turn two, others on turn 10. 

I named two in the majority of those games, because the data didn't show me an obvious winner. Besides that, 2 was the number everyone else was recommending. Naming two will trigger on Ragavan, Tymna, Najeela, Kinnan, Dockside, Underworld Breach

My reasoning behind always naming 2 was very one-dimensional: my gut told me that two should be the right number if the data doesn't show a clear winner. As already mentioned, two hits a lot of the prevalent commanders and other popular staples. I quickly noticed that this evaluation wasn't quite right.

I tracked the relevant spells and ended up with the result of 112 spells (naming one) vs. 94 spells (naming two). Although one came out ahead again, I still don't think the difference is significant enough to make a final call on what to always name. 

My Recommendations Moving Forward

First off, unless you are leaning into Clone effects, like Sakashima the Impostor

If we are going first or second and have a turn one Talion, I would probably recommend naming one to draw a couple of cards off of Mystic Remora

If you are facing decks that need a little bit of setup to develop and have commanders that will trigger Talion, I'd probably lean into naming two. Kinnan, Bonder Prodigy, Tivit, Seller of Secrets or the partner pairing of Tymna, the Weaver and Kraum, Ludevic's Opus come to mind. Naming two will allow you draw off of some of their mana rocks and development spells to keep up with those higher colored decks and their arguably better card quality.

Lastly, I want to emphasize that naming one or two also depends on the kind of Talion deck you are playing and the way you expect the game to play out. There are some vastly different, first brews out there. Some brewers like me try to slow down the game with cards like Grafdigger's Cage

Due to Talion being brand new, my dear friends Martin, aka Snuske, and Loren, aka MTG_HotDog, and me are currently still testing a lot of cards. We will most likely settle on some kind of adaptive control version that seeks to utilize tempo plays and devastating stax pieces to buy enough time to close out the game. This leads me to believe that we want to name one the majority of the time, because our opponents will use their cheap interaction spells to fight back. You can check out our current list (as stated, work in progress) here:

Moxfield Link